im having trouble with my kite

[bradbarton]

i was just wondering.. Im up at bear lake right now and yesterday around 4pm i had a perfect wind for kiting i got my kite in the air board on and for some reason my kite is acting wierd it's not getting the resonse i want out of it. About 5 minutes later my main bladder lost most of it's air. Could this be the reason?
Once it fell to the water it just flopped around like a dead fish. i was lucky enouph to still get it to relaunch but once it got in the air, it seems like because of the lack in air pressure i have no control it also seems like it is flattening out in the air as if i was pulling on the fifth line or something.. Anyways i have had nothing but problems with this kite i just wanted some suggestions. Im pulling the bladder out right now to patch the hole..
It is an RRD 16 meter i think from 2003. I an 6"1 and about 160-170 lbs. Am i using the correct setup...?

[Kenny]

Brad,

The technology for kites improved dramatically in 2005 with the introduction of bow, sle, and hybrid kites. The bow and sle kites especially were important for kiters that ride inland lakes because the wind is usually very gusty on our local lakes. Therefore, if you go kiting with the local crew you will notice that most of them are on Best and Ozone kites. Part of the reason is that the US Distributor for Ozone, Windzup is owned by locals Brian and Heather Schenk and we have Jacob Buzianis who is a Best team rider and rep. The other reason is that they offer kites that work great in the gusty wind that we frequently encounter. I recommend selling your RRD and buying a Best Waroo or Ozone Instinct that is a 2006 or newer.

Now back to your question - Don't fly your kite until you have repaired the bladder, it will not perform properly until you do.
How to repair the leading edge bladder.
1. Open the velco opening on both ends of the leading edge.
2. Tie a line or cord to each end of the leading edge bladder.
3. Open up the zipper located near the center of the leading edge.
4. It is easier if you have someone to hold onto the end of the leading edge while you pull the bladder out.
5. When you have pulled out the bladder untie the lines from the leading edge and tie them off on the center spar inflation nipple.
6. Inflate the leading edge and then dunk it in a large bucket of water to check for bubbles. This is just like checking the leaks on a bicycle inner tube, but on a larger scale. Once you find the leak, mark it with a pen. Check for multiple holes as it really stinks to repair one hole to later find out that there were several.
7. Use the instant patches that you use for a bicycle inner tube to repair any hole(s).
8. Dry off the leading edge and deflate it.
9. Dust the leading edge with baby powder to ensure that is does not wrinkle or crumple inside the leading edge.
10. Carefully fold the leading edge so that it will be aligned properly with no twists.
11. Reattach the cords and then ask your assistant to hold onto the middle of the kite while you gently pull the tubes to each end.
12. Secure all openings and then slowly reinflate the kite. While inflating check to make sure there are no twists, if you have a twist you will have to pull the bladder out from that side and then reinsert it again. If there are not twists, inflate the kite halfway and then check the length of the leading edge in both directions to make sure there are no folds or crinkles. You may need to inflate and deflate the kite a couple times to get the leading edge smoothed out properly. Once you have the leading edge all sorted out, inflate the kite fully and let it sit for 20 minutes to make sure the kite stays pressurized.

Good luck!

Kenny

[bradbarton]

hey thanks kenny... So i would definatly be intersted in getting a different kite in that case. what size would you recommend? i weigh about 170

[bradsaxe]

C Kites rule! Don't believe the hype. And don't limit yourself to those brands.

[Jacob Buzianis]

Yea, C-kite rules if the winds was more steadier out here in Utah but it doesn't happen very often here.

[btjsfca]

I'm not sure how everyone else feels about it, but I would think that having more than one type of kite might be the way to go. Nuclear winds are rare here, so you may not even bother with a small kite unless you want gorge trips in your future. That 6 or 7m sle may not see too much action. Some, but not much. I'd say that there are two types of conditions to worry about: light wind and mid-range wind. At Utah Lake north wind launches, I find the wind to be smooth and nice most of the time. In these conditions, a C-kite might set you nicely. Don't listen too hard to these guys -- c-kites have also drastically improved their depower abilities right alongside of bow kites, and they offer a distinctly different feel. The jumps (from what goes around on the forums) are more explosive, and they handle better through kiteloops and such. Kiters love the feel of c-kites, and it's why the industry is doing all they can to build sles with a "c-kite feel". For the lighter stuff, a big bow (like 13m) is great. You won't be out there throwing down hard in those conditions (probably), so having a kite that depowers well through the gusts and performs efficiently through the lulls is a good idea. It will get you going well on the snow, too.

The downsides: higher winds, especially in the snow, tend to be gusty and unsteady. Not a dealbreaker, but something to look out for. Also, relaunch of a c-kite can be a bit more challenging, but again, c-kite relaunch has been getting easier and easier over the last few years. The other issue is adjusting to the different timing of each kind of kite. But if you fly both kites often enough, you should be able to adapt quickly.

As the brits say, horses for courses. Don't be afraid to break the mold a bit if you think that it will fit better with where you want to go with your kiting.

Updating to a modern C-kite, though, is a good idea. C kites that people like:
North Vegas
SS Fuel

Now you all can eviscerate me.

-J

[bordy]

Saftey

Its really about saftey and c-kites just do not have the ability to cover a large enough wind range even the new kites. I ride almost everyday its windy in UT and have flown a c-kite 0 times this year. I have the option to however. I fly the Ozone kites because they feel a lot like a c-kite but have way more depower for when the wind goes from 10-30and back to 10.

The reason you see out lot of Ozone and best kites here are not only because they work so sweet here, but becuase there are local ties to each company, Ozone having Windzup as the US distributor, and Cloud nine selling thoose brands.

And Jake the best rep living in the area, Brain and Heather from Ozone have done and do, do a ton for the sport here in Ut, opening new areas to kiting, keeping the forest service aware of what goes on, Promoting kiting to begginers through kiteutah.com, giving lesson. Jakes out there on the water almost every day I am pimping kiting also. Thats the reason Ozone and Best gear are all over our beaches, Becuase that is the best way the locals can say thanks and keep alot of us kiting for work, By buying the local gear and keeping the local vib alive!

Thinking out side the box is fine, get what ever kite gear you think is best for you. But what has Naish, North, Slingy, Cab done for our local seen, almost nothing but becuase of Ozone, and Best there is a kite community in UT, your choice.

Brad,

I weigh 160ish and fly from 11-15m kite most of the time in UT, I also have a light wnd board(a glide) to make the best out of the lighter days we get in UT.

If I only could have one kite it would be a 13 if I only had 2 my choices it would be 11m and a 15m. I how ever have a full quiver.

Good luck and keep asking questions. You can also Go to Windzup.com for info on Ozone stuff or also to the Best website.



Justin, When's the last time you flew a c-kite?

[Kenny]

Justin,

Hmmm... What is all of this talk about a modern c kite? I have seen you primarily on PL kites. Have you purchased some modern C kites and if so, what did you buy? Have you tried the sle or bow kites back to back with a modern C? If so, I would like to learn more.

Kenny

[btjsfca]

Hee hee!

Ahhh ... yes. I flew (briefly) a vegas this weekend in the gorge. Nice, quick, but didn't take it out, so can't really comment. I make the comments because the peter lynns I fly are more like c-kites than sles. In fact, the synergy is compared to fuels in their feel. Since I don't have the time on inflatos, I can't verify that. So, don't take my comments as gospel. But, like I say, my kites are c-like, and my depower is fine.

I'll repeat: horses for courses. What do you want to do with your kite? In the end we're all riding and having fun with them. As far as safety, I saw plenty of people out riding in the gorge with c-kites, and the wind there is nuts! It's true that when it was 30 gusting 40, the c-kites went in the bag. But I said: horses for courses. When the wind is strong and highly variable, it's not fair to compare that to 20 mph, steady winds.

Yes, we've had a fatality here. It was on a c-kite. That might color things. What happens when a rider is on a bow with the stopper pulled in when the sh!t hits the fan? Could be a bad scene. Good judgement and reflexes play a role too. Riding an SLE may offer a false sense of security, since things go wrong on all kinds of kites.

Billy: yes, it's nice to have reps local, but it's the people, not the companies that matter. You were a Best guy, now you're an ozone guy. Couldn't you have become a Cab guy? What if you made a connection to Slingy? It would sure be nice to have more companies here, with more options for demos and stuff, but I'd imagine that if the community grows, the options will grow, too. But, for all of us, no company has made the scene here; it's the guys who are on the beach, on the snow, answering questions, helping, teaching, and keeping the sport alive. Period. Brian himself would say that he wants kiting to grow, and if Ozone benefits, it's just a bonus for him.

If someone comes into kiting in Utah, and decides to buy one kite or another, we will all be there trying to help: teaching them, launching them, and sharing the stoke (and skunk) together.

There are many reasons to choose the kites in your quiver. Almost all modern kites meet a certain standard of performance, but not every kite is meant for the same purposes or fly with the same character. We pick our kites to match our style, and there's no reason that we all have to ride Ozones or Bests. I've really enjoyed my kites, DC Jim is also enjoying his Peter Lynns. Neither of us needed a rep to hold our hand to decide that's what we wanted, and our lack of BOW style isn't ruining our time.

As far as Brad should be concerned: a 2003 kite is missing out on 5 full years of advances in kite design (6 actually, considering that the 09's are trickling out now), and therefore, is probably in need of a new ride. But, given that, he's got a range of choices, many of which he'd be perfectly happy with.

Now, can we all just get along?

Luv,
Justin

[Marty Lowe]

Don't listen too hard to these guys
-J

Wow, thats a little #$%^!@, isn't it?


-Marty

[lesvierra]

I had so much trouble with my 2003 Best Yarga C kite when I started learning here in Utah. It was like getting on a bull at Pineview because I really didnt know how to handle the gusts, lulls, etc. I happened in some semi steady winds a couple of times and realized that the kite was fine with steady wind combined with my entry level skills, but steady was not the norm I found.

When I got my first sle, it was night and day. Everything seemed so much easier. Definately get a sle or bow before C kite. Dont take my word for it, listen to these guys. They probably havent flown every kite out there, but they know what DOES work. C kites would probably be great at Utah lake on a North, but realistically you'll find yourself kiting at places like bear lake, rush lake, willard, pineview, deer creek. There are some killer gusts that come through on occasion with out warning. Man I'd hate to be on a C kite when that happens. I'm sure there are some cool kites that munch the gusts that arent represented, maybe even some new c kites. I often went against advice given to me on this forum cause I had to learn for myself. But learning the hard way can kill you.

[bordy]

Don't listen too hard to these guys
-J

Wow, thats a little #$%^!@, isn't it?


-Marty

Yea from a guy who missed weeks of kiting becuase he hot launched, then got dragged down wind for hundred yards and lost a toenail on his "safe C style kites"

Justin, Come on man. We are talking saftey not pimping Peter Lynn gear.

By the wat DC Jim got hurt kiting and is now back to wind surfing. Thoose Pyter Lynns are uber safe you know?

And for your and the rest of the boards info. I choose to work with Ozone. Sure I could have gone with another company and tried to promote them locally, but I picked Ozone becuase of what they have done for the sport in our area and world wide. Look at all the stuff Ozone makes comapare them to other kite companys and you decide how bad ass they are, thats what I did......

I really want to close with WTF and Why THE F would you tell I guy on our local forum not to listen to local people in the area he wants to kite who are sharing great info again. These same people are responable for giving awsome advice 100 of times based on years of experanced here in UT.

This is not KITEFORUM.COm where some tool in flordia is trying to tell some newbie in spain whats up. This is our local kite community and you just steped on alot of toes. Not Cool yo.

I am also confusied why you would pimp C-kites your peter lynns are not c-kite in any way shape or form. Its like saying strawberrys and apples are the same becuase they are both red and fruit?????????? plus whens the last time you flew a fuel to back to back with your peter lynn gear to back up your "fuel like feel statement, sounds to me alot of your advise and notes are coming second hand from Kiteforum.com post you have read not first hand like some other posters.

Lastley It is the companys that matter with out good companys there would never be a chance for people to have the resourse to promote the sport.

when you say "Brian himself would say that he wants kiting to grow, and if Ozone benefits, it's just a bonus for him." Remember you pitching to a guy who is out teaching new people to become kiters daily, I don't want to seem to rude but how is it cool to tell they guy whos on the beach everday pimping kiting and all the gear that goes with it regurdless of the manufactor, to everyone every day how it should be????? You just should ofed me?????

Kiting is serious shit. Its not some brand war about whos kite does what best, it is about being able to go out and have the best experance possible as safeley as possible, this cats not doing it now on a c-kite and your advise was to look into another c-kite becuase there is to much best and ozone gear already hear in UT and that he should not listen to closley to the advise here on the UWA site????????? You know damn well if we were on the beach and you made that stament you would have not had time to finish it with out being confrounted. We are trying to keep the sport safe! Not colorful.

Much love BB

[bradsaxe]

I like what btjsfca's point... the horses for courses idea. At the end of the day it is what works for you and that may take some time to figure out if you are just getting started.

Now admittedly I was trying to stir the S#@t a little with my post but I truely believe that C kites out-perform SLE's. They even work in gusts in spite of what is being said here, you just have to know what you are doing.

And Billy, while I appreciatiate what you might have done for kiting in the area that really has little to do with what type of kite one should ride. What suits your riding style should determine what type of kite you ride. That's great you love your kite but I don't think a forum is a place to promote certain brands over others.

As for safety, it is not right to label C kites as unsafe. I just finished reading on another forum about SLE's inverting at the zenith of a jump. How safe is that? I have never had a C kite invert on me in my life. Kiting is inherently dangerous. Ultimately the operator is the determining factor in safety and given some minor things I have witnessed recently we ought to be posting about issues like right of way and where to place your kite when overtaking etc.

As for Brad, don't listen to me when I say C kites are the way to go. They are for me, however, if I was learning these days perhaps I would purchase SLEs but I am not so I won't.

[bordy]

Brad,

I am a team rider and rep for Ozone so its my job to promote the prodect.. on my local forum.. Plus its how I make a living?????

And the fact that the OP is a newbie learning to kite has a bunch to do with it.

I fly every thing from foils to c-kites to sle's so my opion is just that mine take it for naught.

And its utter bullshit to say C-kites work in gust there just is not the same amount of bar throw its a math problem not a skill issue, when DC went from 8-to 48 and back to 8 in four minutes last month every one was just fine on SLE gear scared silly but fine. I could not imagain what would happen if any one was on a c-kite. When I am hundreds of feet of the ground on my SLE I have never worried about it inverting at the zenith as you read on a forum.

I find it ackward that you and justin are pitching "riding style" and Kite matching to a newbie kiter. The only goal for the OP right now is to learn to kite as safley as possible here in UT. Not what kite works best for him and his style of riding....... He doesn't have a style yet, he doesn't know where his kiting is going yet and you guys are pitching c-kites as safe and usable here in UT when there are much better options.

If the dude had said "hi I have been riding four years and like to fly unhooked most of the time, I am learning to throw the mega loop but really don't like all the throw and depower of my current kites any help would be great" then game on, But not" Help I cant fly my kite the Bladder thingy has no air is that a problem"

Again just my opinion.

Are you Brad and Trina, Brad????? Have we met? DO you fly sles?

I can't argue the horse for course point, I tottaly agree that there is a tool for every job. But not for the OP needs yet.

[Marty Lowe]

There are only a few not good kites out there any more.
Why should you buy local?
Some consumers will, some never will.

I see it in my store all the time.
Consumers come in to get all the information,
then buy from Walmart, where you get no information,
or buy the cheapest stuff they can find online,
then come to me for information or to fix it.

It's the consumers choice to decide.

Both Best and Ozone have many kites in thier lineup that can fit any need,
it is not just 2 kites
and the bonus of local support for best setup, fixes and information.
If you notice its never Jake (Best) or Windzup (Ozone)that start the brand wars,
it's always the guys on the sidelines that get it started.

Just remember, around here you can always get a chance to try before you buy.
Where else do you get that option?

-Marty