Utah Windriders Association

Powder Mountain created a mailer that needs to go out to all kiters regarding their rates for kiters. I think Brian will help distribute and it'll be posted here.

Please dont consider this a formal announcement, just a question. I'd like to take this info back to Pow Mow for reconsideration. They are more excited than ever about snowkiting and we are lucky to be able to use their land.

Question:

Who would buy a $30 kiter day pass?
Inlcudes use of the puma lift.

Who would buy a $300 kiter season pass?
Includes use of the puma lift.

Good news is they are offer kiters only a great preseason all area season pass, $650.

Who would get a season pass.

My assumption is that many of the local kiters will end up not going to Powder Mountain because of cost and there are enough other places to ride that might be closer.

Very local kiters like myself, Ken, Nate, Auggie would probably get an all area season pass for sure if they dont already have them. Great combo.

I'm meeting with pow mow again this week to discuss. I'd like to get your opinion (seems like we were here last year). They are enjoying the media attention generated from the kite festival and I think they will continue to enjoy the attention if kiters are coming to Pow Mow and their visitors see the kiters. With these rates, I fear local kiters will not come. Would you come if you had to pay these rates?

Would you pay these prices if there were terrain park type features??
Sliders.
Kickers.
Walls.

Possibly pay for a day pass with the option to ride lifts if it didnt blow.
Most likely not a season pass with other free areas to ride. Unless I win the lottery.

Les,

I would be willing to pay for the day pass. A season doesn't make sense for me as the terrain is more wide open at Skyline and Strawberry.

Kenny

Les,

See what they say about a $10.00 kite pass. I think that is more resonable.

Brighton charges $10.00 and you can ride the lift and hike there backcountry..

Ry..

Brian mentioned something about backcountry type passes also somewhere. Anyone else know where ski areas are charging similar fees?

i agree. $30 is steep. maybe if they had terrain features, but even then it's steep. go for $10 and we're talking. i suppose that depending on the timing of the day i'd pay $20 to be able to ski down and take the lift back up the parking area instead of walking....

Considering the other "free" spots to ride close by and my "thriftiness", I can't imagine ever paying $30 to ride. Maybe $10 at the most with a refund or credit if there is no wind!

Last year they didn't want a special pass for kiters. I have already inquired about kiting and they said everything is the same as last year. Last year the official word was-buy the cheapest pass that Powder Mountain sells. That would be a Tiger Tow pass that is only good on the beginner rope tow at Sundown lift. This takes care of the tresspass liabilities and allows you access to the riding area. I know it was cheap, $10-$15 or something like that. I am not sure if they have considered all of the responsibilities that come with selling a pass but here are a few:

1. Medical services and evac in case of an accident.
2. What if the wind dies?
3. What if the wind starts to get good at closing time? Are we obligated to leave? Or can we just stay and kite? What if someone gets hurt after the resort closes?
4. Can you trade in a pass when the wind dies for a ski pass?
5. The snowcat operators hated trying to build features last year. A 10,000 lb snowcat just flounders in the loose snow.
6. Maybe if they design a kiter pass they could include one free ride up on the Hidden Lake lift. That would sure make it easier than hiking out at the end of the day.
7. The liability release on the back of the lift ticket doesn't address kiting hazards-only ski hazards.

It doesn't matter to me-I work there and already have a season pass for this year. I just would like to see it done with all of the issues properly presented so there are no surprises for either side.

There are just to many free spots to kite to consider paying. Part of the reason I got into snowkiting was to not pay a ski area a single penny. I know lots of friend who spent there season pass money on kites for this very reason....

I can't even afford to buy kites let alone pay to kite.......

I think powder mtn would just be chasing away kiters with a fee. It would chase me away for sure.

Imagine if winsurfers and kiters had to pay to ride on water?????????

I would have to agree with the majority... If I didn't get a season pass to ski every year I don't know if I'd pay to kite up there. Maybe a one ride for a few bucks just to ride hidden lake back to the parking lot. Maybe they could have kiters sign a waiver form, releasing pow mow from any type of liability? And have it be a use at own risk thing... to keep it free?
~nate

If I read the newspaper correct.
This will all be moot in a few years anyway.
Condos and golf courses on the prime kite spot.
Just as well start to look for alternatives now.

-Marty

I agree that it is inevitable in regards to development, but the other thing to think about is that there are lots of places to kite up there but we just stop at the first one. I kind of hope that someday we can drive close enough to Flattop Mountain to make kiting there feasible. If kiting takes off and there is a good rapport with the owners they just might consider Flattop as a summer golf course/winter kite area. The few times that I have been out to Flattop, it has been quite surprising how big it reallly is. The far edge of the ridge rolls over and conceals a lot of terrain that you can't see from Hidden Lake.

At last weeks Ski Patrol meeting we had the investors rep show up and talk for a while. He said the long range plan is 30 years for development. He also said that he doesn't forsee any building for at least 3-4 years. In 30 years I will be 80- will I still be kiting?

I keep hearing about a crackdown this year on people poaching runs on the Condo road by using their own vehicle. I have also heard that no area will be allowed to be skiied, even if you have a season pass, unless it is open. There is a group of people who hit the condo road early on powder days before anyone gets there-they will not be able to do that this year. I would think that this enforcement policy and trend may extend to the kiting area.

Don't get me wrong, I totally agree with Bordy's comments about kiters not really needing to buy a pass. But I'm not the one you have to convince. I have already told management in a board meeting that if I am headed to Pow Mow to kite and Pineview is ripping when I go past it then I just stop at Pineview and kite. Its almost like they don't want to hear about of this free side of kiting. However, it still costs money to get into state parks to kite. Maybe they would agree to the pricing structure at Willard Bay for instance-$9 to get in or $70 (?) for a season pass?

Although if they keep some of that golf course tree-free, then there's winter kiting options and the features in the course will make perfect rollers for launching off of.

As far as the fee, I'm with everyone else. 10 bucks is great if we can find a way to use the lift for a final ride out, although that may be impractical if you haul a second kite out to cover changing winds, plus all the pumps and various accessories that most kiters need to bring along. Too much baggage to take up.

All in all, it sounds like I won't make it to PowMow again this season. Sounds too complicated for my tastes.

-J

btjsfca wrote:10 bucks is great if we can find a way to use the lift for a final ride out,
-J

Most days the lift is already closed while we are still kiting,
walking out will still be the only option,
unless they kick us off at closing time.
Then the value goes down even more.

-Marty