Losing Richardson's Flats in PC???

[RickHeninger]

Ralph et. al.,

Whatever you need from the "UWA" let me know... I'd be happy to make a call if you prepare somebody and they want representation blah blah. I actually have a client that was an accountant for Talisker. He actually works acrossed the desk of Bob "Trip" Houk now at Merill Lynch! I'm sure he'd know somebody.

I'll be here when and if you need my help on this issue.

Rick Heninger.

[Kevin Dobson]

I have talked with many longtime local kiters who feel this issue needs to be dealt with and not just swept under the rug. For me and others getting permission is the right thing to do, it's about respecting others property. The "beg for forgiveness" rule was meant for land that is fenced (Home Depot,Desperation Flats) or obviously privately owned not land that has been posted.
For those that want to know, I talked to Kerry Gee(435-333-6601) today and they don't want people kiting out there. I told him I was calling on behalf of myself and there were many kiters that would still be going out there. All he said was that they would get the "message".
In my opinion, it is time to get the UWA involved, individuals should make phone calls, pull those strings. It would have been better to start the process as soon as the signs were noticed than to think that they didn't pertain to us.
Sure, there will be people that don't know about the issues but I think we will only make the problem worse by not addressing it.

[RickHeninger]

Those of you who know more on this subject need to come up with a plan and we'll help.

I just don't know anything about the kiting site. Who owns the property? What are their reasons for not wanting kiters on it? Why are they concerned? Has somebody sat down with that person? Will chatting with that person be counterproductive? Are there other better strategies for dealing with it?

Les Vierra would be the UWA representative for the Snowkiters on issues of access.

[Ralph Morrison]

OK, I think the best plan is to find out what their issues are and see if we can work with them to find a happy solution. Approaching them as UWA would have the most clout. I'm willing to speak on UWA's behalf but it would be great to have a couple more of you guys to help with brainstorming and to go to any meetings that we might have. Give me a call 435-901-0557 Ralph

[Marty Lowe]

Ralph,
I feel that one spokesman, with the backing of UWA is best,
find the issues, and then communicate via forum to members.
That is how I approached "Rush Randy" , as the UWA spoksman.
If you can, give the person a Gift, (i.e. gas card)
It can go a long way to show good faith.
(I 'm sure UWA, or other doners will reimberse you)

You are a great listiner, and will represent UWA well.

-Marty

P.S. Jon reports possibility that the fence has already been replaced at Rush,
going north and south, and no longer in the water.
Details to follow.....

[MikE mAy]

oohhhhh!

i just realized that i remembered the last name Gee somewhere. i have a personal connection with Kerry Gee, and if you'd be ok wiht it, i'd sure like to get in on the negotiations. their son went to school with my little sister, and he and his wife know my parents well. their son also came to my wedding by virtue of my little sister. point is, i think i may have some strings to pull, or at least bring the issue closer to home and make him think about the problem a bit more. he's not just affecting a bunch of faceless winter sports junkies, he's hurting a family friend. i've met the guy, and at least outside of work he is a very nice approachable person and i think i may have something to offer here.

Ralph, Marty, Kevin- do you want to give me a call and we can discuss the issues a bit more and perhaps i can call Kerry and discuss things further? does the UWA collective want me involved at all? sometimes in this world it's not what you know but who you know....

it seems that there has got to be some reasonable accomidation to be made.

let me know. i'll be out of town tomorrow though saturday night but will be checking emails and answering my cell phone as much as i can.

laters,

Mike
801-971-2380

[RickHeninger]

So, looks like you guys have a great committee on this... Ralph, Mike, Kevin, Marty, and call and enlist Les Vierra's help as the "official" UWA Snowkite representative, that is if "official" is even necessary. And I'll also do whatever is needed as far as letters or phone calls once you guys figure out the political undertones. Looks like you Ralph are the Chair of this committee. And Mike's got some possible leverage to help you with.

PS... If there are others who might have some leverage to offer like Mike May, please speak up and let these guys know.

[lesvierra]

You can bypass me, please. I'm up to my ears in work. Make the right contacts, see what the issues are, understand their point of view, and see if there is solution for both. Good luck.

[MikE mAy]

i sent some messages with his son on facebook today confirming that i'm thinking about the same person. he confirmed it. he also said that in the past, he thought they just signed a waiver or something and said it was cool. he seemed to know exactly what i was talking about. so, my thoughts are that this could work. sign up with the UWA, sign a waiver, display a sticker or membership card or something and we are cool. the only problem is of course access to non locals or non UWA members, and how do we enforce a policy like this?

i'm also going to send an email to our lawyer and see if they have any input on potential liability issues or if they have dealt with something like this before. perhaps simple signs posted at the carpark warning of the dangerous nature of kiteboarding and releasing liability of PC Mining or something. how many bike trails cross into private land, and how many lawsuits do you see there? there has got to be some sort of precident we can go on here.

anyway, perhaps talk to me about potential solutions to present to Kerry and i can call him if everyone agrees. i think i would have a good repore with him and would be a good choice. however, if anyone has any different ideas i'm game. by talking to his son, kelly, i'm sure he will eventually talk to his dad about it and the personal leverage or connection has already been made, so there's that and i can step back very easily.

let me know.


and, yes, i'm still a kiter despite my pitiful lack of dedication to take advantage of the less than ideal snow conditions. shame on me.... perhaps this is my guilt talking here.

[Mark Johnson]

Your the MAN, Mike!

[RickHeninger]

This part gets a bit sticky... As far as the waiver's go... This would have to be worked out with them if that's the issue, where they would have a list of people who have signed the waiver and if you haven't then you are essentially trespassing type of thing. Not only will an insurance company not cover our end, we don't have nearly enough money to sponsor the liability of this. However, I would think that one of the kiteboarding companies might work with you on this part of the issue, as the "sponsor"... Why don't you call Jake or Brian and see what the commercial end holds.

I don't know if the "L" word (liability) is even one of their major issues. But I'd tread carefully in talking about it.

If anybody has any knowledge or expertise in THIS part of the issue, please contact Ralph Morrison or Mike May.

[MikE mAy]

Ralph and i talked briefly a few days ago. Ralph was going to set up a meeting with Kerry and we'll see exactly what the issues are. we hope to get this done next week and we'll report back to the group.

[Kevin Dobson]

What if we came up with a plan to go to the city and ask for a snowkite park. All we really need is land a place to park. Park City has a skateboard park, bmx dirt jump park, cross country, dog parks, etc. It's "Park" City right. How many signatures does it take? Maybe them and the UWA working together with land owners in the future could help open up all kinds of possibilities.

[tjacques]

kevin
I think that is a good idea.
todd

[tjacques]

so i went by there. posted signs clearly visible. If it is posted it is illegal. we need to either get permission or not kite there untill rectified. if we piss the land owner off by acting stupid????? then we are idiots, IMHO!!!! if they know now that we are trying to start talks with them and we kite there, how does that make us look as group???
IMHO